07-7-2011 at 2:19 AM

I don't think gay marriage should be allowed because you can't have kids with a female/female or male/male. Male/female pairs are most logical because they can actually reproduce.<br /> <br /> I'm not saying it isn't natural, as I've heard of animals acting homosexual. In my opinion, there was something mentally wrong with thoes animals.

07-7-2011 at 2:09 AM

...And yet, you give no reasons WHY you don't support gay marriage. Don't just come into a debate, say you don't support it and leave. Give me one GOOD reason why gay marriage shouldn't be legal.<br /> <br /> And let's point out all the null and void anti-gay marriage reasons:<br /> 1.) Any religious reasons. We have seperation of church and state, which means these are thrown out the window.<br /> 2.) It's unnatural. False. It occurs in nature and many studies show that it is the way that we are born that decides our sexuality.<br /> 3.) It takes away from the sacredness of marriage. Divorce. End of argument.<br /> <br /> Seriously, give me one reason, one good logical reason that gays should be treated as second-class citizens. Why are you, as a presumably straight person, more of a person than me, a bisexual genderqueer? Why is your love more valid than mine? Answer me that. Why are you allowed to marry who you love, but I may not be?

07-7-2011 at 2:03 AM

I personally don't think gay marriage should be allowed. This is my opinion, and I understand that you have yours, and it's probably different. I'm not saying I'm going to hate on the LGBT community, so don't act like I am. If you can't handle the fact that my opinion is different than yours, then this thread shouldn't be in the debate forum. There are two sides to every story, and I'm willing to listen to and respect each one of them, regardless of my own opinion. If you can't do the same and are just going to hate me because I don't support gay marriage, then as I've said before, you don't belong in the debate thread. Maybe it'd be better to make a "Show Your Support for Gays" thread.

07-6-2011 at 11:37 PM

<i>"Gays have the same rights as straights do. Don't say that they DON'T have the right to marry, because they do."</i><br /> <br /> I think, earlier in this thread, someone pointed out that gay marriages are only legally entitled to about <i>half</i> of the things that male/female marriages get. People have died in hospitals without their same sex partner because hospitals have refused to acknowledge their partnership and let the other person visit. Some states don't even recognize their marriages at all, so what you said is completely false. Gay marriages are only allowed in six (I think?) states currently. As far as I know, it isn't even federally recognized.<br /> <br /> <i>"There are always going to be two sides to the argument, so why is my side so wrong?"</i><br /> <br /> Well, perhaps it is because you are telling them they don't have any rights based on their sexual orientation. I don't blame them for getting upset, they have just as much right as you or me to be in love with someone of the same sex and marry them. When you say you don't support that, you are basically saying they are lesser of a person than you.<br /> <br /> As for the furry thing, I am a straight female furry myself. If you look at <a href="http://www.klisoura.com/ot_furrysurvey.php">The Furry Survey</a> for 2011, it says that only 12.57% was compeletely homosexual, while 23.07% was compeltely heterosexual. Just because the gay males speak the loudest in the fandom, doesn't mean that's mainly all it is. Keep in mind a lot of females make their characters male just to avoid the downright hate they do get from some of the males in the fandom. I've seen people post female art and get literally FLOODED with "EWW NASTY FEMALE" comments.<br /> <br /> <i>"Some furries are in to "yiff" (sexual relationships with animals.."</i><br /><br /> Uh no, sex with animals is beastiality and that is greatly looked down upon, even hated, by most furries. Yiffing usually just refers to anthromorphic sex, but I guess some people do use it to define sex in general. This is off topic though, so....

07-6-2011 at 11:05 PM

It isn't a choice. At all. When did you choose to be straight? I did not choose to be this way. At all. Also, it is natural. It happens in nature. A lot. Also, you're an idiot for bringing up the whole everyone turning gay thing. 10% of people are gay, based on statistics. And that's how it will stay. That doesn't threaten the human species at all. Also, many animal species are doing great, while partaking in homosexual activities often.<br /> <br /> Also, I have absolutely no respect for you for saying the same right of marriage as everyone else. Effing false. Everyone else can marry who they love. Forcing a gay man to marry a straight women is a horrible idea. I know a gay man who almost let that happen to him. He had proposed, they had a date picked out, etc.

07-6-2011 at 10:26 PM

But you <i>are</i> born gay, lesbian, bi, etc. There's pretty definitive proof of this, too.<br /> <br /> <a href="http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2006/05/060508_lesbian.html">Lesbians respond differently to male pheromones</a>. And that was from '06! It blows my mind that people still ignore that study.

07-6-2011 at 10:09 PM

I don't hate LGBT people. I'm just saying it's not what I personally see as "normal". Now am I going to taunt and bully and shun LGBTs? No.<br /> <br /> And to answer your question, a furry can be described in different ways. A furry is generally a person who draws/writes stories about human-like animals. Some of them dress up as these animals and make a new persona for themselves (an animal persona, often called a "fursona"). Some furries are in to "yiff" (sexual relationships with animals and/or animal people). I personally do not believe in "yiffing", but you can believe what you want.

07-6-2011 at 10:00 PM

Kira, the way most of our civilization sees each other as "normal" is a basic male/female relationship. Now an LGBT member might see it as normal too, but they might also see male/male or female/female relationships as normal to them. It isn't their fault that they think differently than straight people, it's just the way their brain was wired. Some people who are still in the closet are afraid of being taunted by society, because of the way they think. If our society could accept them, there wouldn't be as much bullying and hate crimes against LGBT's.<br /> <br /> Also, I feel like I haven't been out much, what's a furry?

07-6-2011 at 9:57 PM

I wouldn't say that you're "born gay/straight/bi/etc". I think it's more of a complicated choice. I know it's not as simple as choosing to have pizza for dinner, but I still do believe that it is a choice. And I say being gay isn't "normal" because naturally a male and a female partner up to create new life. The whole point (in nature, where I mind you, human beings have come from, just as everythin else) in living is to reproduce and keep your species alive. If everyone was to suddenly turn gay, it would be more difficult (not impossible) for our species to have and raise more of its kind... But if I've put my two cents in and lost this argument then that's fine. I don't want to get anyone off topic or get anyone started flaming, so fine. You're right and I'm wrong.<br /> And if it's perfectly fine to spread "gay pride" everywhere, but as soon as someone says that they disagree, everyone is turning their backs on them, I ask why. There are always going to be two sides to the argument, so why is my side so wrong? Gays have the same rights as straights do. Don't say that they DON'T have the right to marry, because they do. They have the same right to marry just like everyone else does. They have the right to marry into a male/female relationship. And I understand that it's not the same, but I was just trying to point that out.

07-6-2011 at 9:47 PM

First off, what is abnormal about being gay? Nothing. You are born that way and it is natural. Also, saying that most furries are gay males is a horrible stereotype that has no bearing on this argument.

07-6-2011 at 8:59 PM

Well, gay marriage doesn't really bother me very much, but yeah, I do have my quirks about it. And as I said, I wouldn't really call it "normal" because I would think guy/girl relationships are "normal", but that doesn't mean that LGBT stuff is bad, either. And yeah, it is sin in some religions. I personally was raised to be strictly Christian and I was taught that homosexuality was sin. I guess some of my opinions come from that, but I try to be more open-minded. And as for me "never getting married", that was a joke (which I know I probably should have said it was) since I'm a furry and most furries are gay dudes.

07-6-2011 at 4:04 PM

Kira, I am a little confused. In <a href="http://www.alacritysim.com/forums.php?boardid=8195&category=Debate">this thread</a> you said...<br /> <br /> <i>"I was born a straight female and I still am... I mean, y'know, if you were born a dude but you "feel" like you "are" a girl, then that's cool. And if you're a girl who likes other girls or whatever that's cool too. It really doesn't bother me. The only thing that gets on me is that all of a sudden the rainbow is a symbol for LGBTs all around the world. I mean, seriously, people. I personally like the rainbow 'cause it's all color-y and stuff, and now people think I'm and LGBT person... LGBT needs a new symbol. Other than that, yeah man. I can live and let live."</i><br /> <br /> Why does that not apply to marriage? How would gay couples being allowed to marry hurt anyone or anything? That isn't "living and letting live" by any means. And, as BlackFox pointed out, there is seperate of church and state for a reason. This country isn't all christians, so they have no right to tell others what they can and can't do. They certainly weren't the first religion to have marriages either, so they can't claim it as strictly their own.<br /> <br /> <i>" I would never get married."</i><br /> <br /> Then that is your <i>choice</i>, not the fault of gay marriage. At least you would have that choice, whereas gay couples currently do not. What gives you the right to get married and not them?<br /> <br /> <i>"I don't think it's normal."</i><br /> <br /> Actually, it is very common in nature. People don't choose to be gay any more than they choose to be born with a certain color eyes.

07-6-2011 at 2:14 PM

Also, why would you never get married? Does two women getting married really threaten your relationship that much? Even if they are in love and deserve marriage just as much as you? Well guess what, in that situation, it isn't the LGBT community at fault. It's you.<br /> <br /> And how is it not normal? Considering it is incredibly common in nature and it causes no harm to anyone. Also, it isn't sinful in other relationships. Why is your religion more important than mine? Considering mine isn't completely idiotic in the sense that I believe in human rights and that all humans are equal. And I was born bisexual, and I should be allowed to marry a woman if I like.<br /> <br /> Also, I would like to point out that several great countries and states allow gay marriage. God hasn't come to smite them down yet, and they are all doing fine with the allowance of gay marriage.

07-6-2011 at 1:42 PM

Who cares if its a sin in some religions, Kira? We have freedom of religion AND seperation of church and state. Religious arguments have no bearing in our government. And also, why am I a second class citizen just because I like other women? I deserve the same rights as any straight person. And saying otherwise is insane.

07-6-2011 at 9:07 AM

I'm not at all for it. Just no. I don't think it's normal. In some religions it's sin. Religious people would freak out. I would never get married.

06-28-2011 at 10:49 AM

I think gay marriage benefits the economy tho, because weddings creayes jobs. And a news report said that gay marriage will bring almost 200,000 dollars to the state in the next ten years if I remember correctly.

06-27-2011 at 8:51 AM

I was raised to be anti-gay/lesbian, but I can't really agree with my family. Yes I am straight, but I still believe that anyone should be allowed to marry whomever they want. I mean, just because you think differently than others, doesn't mean you shouldn't find love your own way. I support these rights, and I am glad New York legalized it.

06-27-2011 at 3:45 AM

Bumping this up in response to New York allowing gay marriages now. I think that's enough to reinvigorate this debate, considering it's a big step for us, I think.

06-21-2011 at 3:06 PM

I like you.xD I can understand your previous disagreement with gay marriage from growing up with that belief being instilled in your mind, but I love that you were able to choose for yourself what you thought and believed.<br /> <br /> Also, I agree 100% with this:<br /> "I still think that an individual church should have the choice to deny holding a same-sex marriage."<br /> <br /> I don't think anyone has said otherwise. If a church wants to deny that right, fine. There are a ton of other churches that would be willing to hold same-sex marriages.

06-21-2011 at 9:34 AM

I come from a very religious family. My father is an associate preacher, my mother teaches children church every Sunday morning. Not only that, but I've also been raised in the (very) republican and (usually) anti-lesbian/gay state of Texas. Every fiber of my being, everything I've been taught, and all those days I've sat through church, tells me to be against Same-sex marriages, and yet I can't. I would never be in a same-sex relationship(no offense meant), I simply don't see other girls that way. But I have close friends who do. One of my best friends is a bi-sexual/ usually gay guy and I feel that denying him the basic right would of marriage be unjust.<br /> <br /> I think that people need to think of the couples who are genuinely in love with someone, but unable to marry them because of laws against it. In the end, they are just as human,if not more human, than any homo-phobic politician or overly-religious moron. If they want to get married, and are really in love, than who is anyone to try to stop them. If they choose to adopt a child or children, then what is wrong with that. I guess, that what any person wishes for, gay or not, is to live a life where they want, as they want, with the person they love, so why should be stop anyone.<br /> <br /> I honestly have trouble admitting this... When I first saw this debate, I began writing a response about how same-sex isn't right. But I read a few of the earlier responses and I saw how invalid my points were. I realized that I was being just as horrible and idiotic as the people who repeat incorrect verses and misinterpreted stories in an attempt to prove a point that is completely wrong. Us Christians tend to claim that we are full of love, we repeat verses about what love is, how important love is, all the things that loves can be and can do, and yet we are denying other human beings the right to share their love through marriage. It only makes us sound stupid to the rest of the World... <br /> <br /> I still think that an individual church should have the choice to deny holding a same-sex marriage. By an individual church I Don't mean all catholic churches or anything like that, but 'The First Church of blah blah blah" should be able to decide if they would be okay with holding it within their building(if that makes any sense). Other than that, I think it is not the governments place to decide if a person's love is real or not based on their gender.